London Riots

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How bad is it?

Being blow out of proportion by the media ?

 

Unfortunately it isn't no.

Take a look on YouTube at footage taken by Sky News reporter Mark Stone on his iPhone last night whilst on Clapham High Street.

 

My wife stopped off at Salisbury's in Purley way at around 6 pm on her way home from work. Something kicked off whilst she was at the checkout as loads of police ran throughout the store and in her words "police cars and sirens were coming from everywhere.

I live around a mile from the rest of the incident last night, around 10 ish we saw a police helicopter hovering over Croydon ( a daily occurrence) and didn't take much notice, within 30 minutes there was 5 police helicopters ( possibly the ambulance HEMS was one of them), and palls of smoke in the skyline. 2 of the choppers went away and returned 20 minutes later,

I have read on the news today a man is seriously ill with Gunshot wounds in hospital after being found in a car half a mile away from me, all part of the same situation.

The trams have stopped running from East Croydon to Wandle park because of the fires and there are still sporadic sirens around.

What Amazed me was children as young as 9 or 10 were standing around watching AND going into shops looting and people instead of going home and getting out of the situation were hanging around in the middle of the police lines:wacko:

This has been brewing in Croydon and surrounding area's for ages Mike a legacy of the Politically Correct Twaddle that we have suffered which I'm sure will continue that the police broke some scumbags human rights coz the knocked him over during an arrest and how the police were too brutal an did it all wrong. We need a VERY strong hand with this because the damage people have had done to their property, fear they now have to live with and disruption to their business and daily lives MUST be taken into account because the decent people have done nothing wrong and deserve a quality of life.

I was born and bred in Croydon and live just outside on the borders.

I never ever thought I would witness this, and fear for the living environment my Grand children are facing in the coming years ...

A very sad DTT:sinking: ( Get yer Tin Hats Here :wacko

 

Crazy stuff

[youtube]HWPspUOnvZY[/media]

 

Be safe my Friend

 

Police Helicopters hovering over Croydon again, Keep you posted if it Kicks off again. My first patient has a large electrical store in Purley way. Has just had a call to say the police are recommending All shops are to double board all windows. They Cleaned out PC world in the Purley Way last night according to him . He has just left very angry and very worried.

Cheers
D

 

I live 5 mins from Clapham Junction and was in the area as it all started to kick off and quickly got out of there - the whole area just exploded, those shops have been operating for a number of years, and we have a very strong community spirit. Unfortunaltely the whole 'dont sh*t on your doorstep' rule has gone out the window as many of these mugs live in and around the area!

My friend is in the riot police unit in Brixton having finished a 32 hour shift i spoke to him and he is saying they are literally stretched to breaking - they are all shattered, they cant chase down these looters as their gear is just too heavy, and for every 20 there is something like 200 rioters last time the numbers were going round!

On a side note that sky reported deserves a raise! he was like rambo with an iphone!

Tonight is going to messy again i fear!

 

Sounds awful, Del. Keep safe Darlin`.

Fire & flying machines......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-T35WXFOmwI

 

easy solution call out army shoot looters our country has gone to the dogs hope all you city dwellers keep safe

 

Perhaps we should look at Singapore for ideas on dealing with disaffected feral youth.

David

 

This seems to be a first, (certainly a UK first). Internet rioting.

Flashmobbing has been around for nearly a decade. Generally it's peaceful enough. But someone seems to have twigged that flashmobbing can be used to organise a riot!

The rule of law relies on consent. There are not enough police cells in the city for a fraction of the offenders. Now they've figured out that police cannot be everywhere at once, and they just have to be in enough places to outmanouver them. I hear that there are threats of organised chaos (not an oxymoron any more) in places like gillingham, hastings and others, as well as london.

Its not much short of guerrilla warfare. Small mobile forces trying to stay ahead of the larger enemy. Doing damage then dissappearing. Really scary stuff.

We'll see what happens tonight. These things are organic. If it shrinks we'll all be happy. If it grows and spreads then God help us all. Because there are, and have always been, more scum than police. Society relies on the scum being unaware of this. But social networking allows them to be almost as well organised and far more numerous.

 

It seems they need to stop all mobile phone coverage,internet etc etc won´t happen of course.

I read that there were 5000 police at the royal wedding but 1400 out last night.

 

dont worry rob out in the rural counties we can deal with anarchy big dogs and shotguns we should stand shoulder to shoulder and should punish this small number of antisocial people they have no real strength they are just a bloody nusance.

 

On the subject of policing, the reporting of that made my blood boil. The media have widel criticised the policing and I've heard more than a few people bemoaning what was done, or not done.

From an interview:-

Too bloody right! Anyone who thinks the poor sods who were out last night trying to keep us all safe should do better should be given a small plastic shield and a wooden stick and stuck at the front of the line for a better view of the petrol bomb wielding mob. Then they'd have a right to comment. Sitting in a nice warm studio with nothing more threatening than an autocue failiure to worry about bemoaning how the police had "surrendered the streets" shows a shameful lack of support for the services who were placed in an impossible position!!

And I'm with Del. Anyone with any sense will be at home with door locked at 11 pm tonight. There are no "innocent bystanders" at something like this. But our home secretary seems to think the use of water cannon would be excessive and breech their dear little human rights. Wheras the 50 injured police officers, who did NOT choose to be there and who were facing a mob with NO constraints on whatever weaponry they could lay hands on, we don't worry too much about THIER human rights.

I read they're due to have 13,000 police on duty in london tonight. Which is great provided the people they've drafted in from other places don't leave those place insufficiently protected.

 

There were 6000 police out last night, and they've managed to scrape together 16,000 for tonight.

 

The problem with last nights numbers were many of the police had to be sent home from pure exhaustion. Many had been on from saturday in some areas.

Thankfully many other constabularies are sending specialist officers in, combined with officers back on duty the numbers should be increased - the problem is even then it wont be enough, and when you have areas with small levels of violence compaired to areas such as clapham etc you still need a police presence, so the police numbers break up more and more until whats left is ineffective against a group of 700 youths.

 

My 15 year old son, has just received notification (via Twitter and Facebook) that there are planned riots for Southampton tonight. Not good.

 

Ethical protest?

 

Apparently a lot of them are Specials And now we can all sleep safe in our beds coz Mr out of touch Cameron and equally out of touch May have returned from their holidays to sort out the problem which if they had actually litened to public opinion wouldnt have happened. They have Cobra sitting now which involves all emergency services and the military and we apparently are gonna have a curfew tonight for kids.

Why cant we have "anyone wearing a hood or covering their face is placed under immediate arrest on suspicion ??

On the subject of the police yep their hands are tied and Yes Rob , I was in the Notting Hill Riots and the Brixton Riots in my previous life back in the 70's and I can only remember the sheer Terror I felt when petrol bombs and assorted items were landing around me and then the Ambo came under attack from youths throwing eveything and anything at us.

We were just there to help nothing more but with rent a mob there anyone in a uniform was fair game. Nothings changed now it would seem.

Yet again, already the human rights of these scum are put before the safety of the police

WHEN are the law abiding tax paying ordinary people in this country going to be listened too ??

Sod Europe and the limp wristed brigade, do as in wartime..Looters will be shot on site that should help .

Cheers
D

 

Same reason they could'nt arrest everyone last night! Where do you put 700 detainees?! You can't arrest them all. You can only move them from one place to another or hem them in. And no one wants the riot hemmed in their street!

Now in Northern Ireland they get treated to a lungful of CS Gas and a nice hose down with a water cannon. But for some reason they seem to shy from that, prefering to send policemen (and they must be mostly specials as you say) in with sticks to get beat up on.

Welcome to the new world. Where "planned riots" is a recognised phrase and where you get the news before it happens via a 15 year olds twitter account. Scary, scary stuff.

 

Saw that and wondered where it all we went wrong in the world today. Probably wasn´t much better before but still something got to be done.

 

This has been going on for many years in Northern Ireland. It is either "recreational rioting" for mischief or is orchestrated for some other malign purpose. The visual evidence shows common theft, looting and wanton vandalism. What or who is behind it? It seems to be controlled in some way and in the absence of an army deployment to restore order - politically a non-starter in the mainland U.K. - police "snatch squads" and very robust policing of gatherings of youth gangs at flash points is about all that can be done. Not every citizen or their property can be protected. One good thing is that, so far anyway, there has been no shooting in confrontations between police and the rioters. Good luck London and elsewhere where there has been trouble.

 

London riots: Theresa May on whether to use army

Good luck tonight folks apparently proactive/consensual policing and dobbing in your family and mates will do the trick.

 

All,
Having seen some of the video footage of these riots I can only commend the restraint of the police for not using their batons to full effect.
I wonder why, on mainland UK, we pussy-foot about with these law-breakers whose behaviour would not be tolerated in other parts of UK (and the rest of the world)?

The Met need to admit they have lost the plot and bring in the army with rubber bullets, water-cannon and tear gas.

If the rioters are organised via social networking sites then vigilante groups can do just the same, and it would serve the lawbreakers right if they had a run-in with such a group.

I for one am fed-up with paying taxes to support these morons, most of whom are probably benefit scroungers.

CF

 

As much as I hate to agree with the HS, soldiers on the street is one place I WOULD draw the line. The army means martial law. Martial law means no civil law, no civil rights, no habeus corpus. More, the effect on the army of being used on its own citizens is potentially disasterous. They're not trained for it!

Thats a genie which is damn hard to get back in the bottle once its out.

Just my view

 

Exactly what Jack and his peers have done. Let`s hope it prevents further mindless violence.

 

I agree that the police should be commended, but it also a point of safety - the police literally cant use their batons to full effect and this would incense the crowd further, and would put their lives at danger - if you see the films from woolwhich of the police being charged at by 700 rioters you can see why they are reluctant.

I would disagree with thought of vigilante groups, so far, considering the emotional and financial hurt caused there has been little in respect of physical hurt (and by that i mean no real number of deaths, even though there has been serious injuries and attempts on life) - the thought of pitch battles would just turn what is a bad situation in a death trap - then there is the moral side of things.

The police do need to solve this problem, but it has to be the police not the army.

 

More power to Jack and his mates. Well done that man.

Dragged up proper that one.

 

I doubt they are `benefit scroungers`, as most are under 18! The majority of the looters are children.

 

I'm with catfoot on this one.

We have a group of politicians who are about as much use as Anne Frank's typewriter. I watched Sky News until nearly 2am last night - and quickly became sick of official statements being released condeming the riots as inexcusable. No sh!t - go do something about it you clowns. There is no message or protest here - these are bottom feeders who have no respect for peoples property and clearly no respect for (or fear of) the police.

What we need is the army to come in and start dishing out some proper kickings. I have friends in the military and I know they feel the same. They can't believe the behaviour of these scumbags.

 

Oddly enough, for some years, he was dragged up by a single parent scrounging benefits too Poverty and the economic climate is no excuse.

 

OK Belinda,
I will correct that and say they are probably the children of benefit scroungers who have been born in to a family lacking any work ethic for generations.

I don't believe that the police can sort this out as they don't have the manpower.

So much for all this PC philosophy - if these rioting kids had been spanked at some time and learned the consequences of bad behaviour, it would be a different story. I wonder what the parents of all these kids think or even if they know where their kids are??

The bill for all this sort of damage is always picked up by the taxpayer - that's you & I
BTW.
I hope some vigilante groups do form and start knocking 7 bells of £h1£ out of the rioters - it would save the police a job.

CF

 

isn´t that just another from of Mob rule ? Just one that you agree with.

Government needs to Govern

 

Agreed.

A good quote from a senior policeman (brum I think).

This was not an angry crowd. This was a greedy crowd.

Go back through history, Riots have generally been united on an issue. Race, Poll tax, whatever. This is just greed, and empowerment. The sheep have cottened on to the concept of strength in numbers, realised that there is only one sheepdog, and that it only chases them when they run away.

Its nothing to do with benefits IMO, its to do with boundries. A generation of kids don't have any and now they don't recognise any.

 

__________________
Because their bloody parents never gave them any!!!

Again a generation of kids brought up without rules or discipline promoted by the PC dont smack the child, or let em play conkers lot

Kids need discipline and to have boundries set because if they dont you get this end result.

I now have 2 police choppers either side of where I live, one on the Croydon side , one on the Sutton side, they have been on station for 30 minutes so something is happening out there :bang:

Re Marks video of the guy getting mugged,

The big guy who nicked something out of the back pack and threw something on the ground, Best case of Ankle equinus I've seen in a long time

Perhaps our forensic pod Ian Linane could offer his services ??

Earn a quid Ian?

As they say, everyones golf shot pleases someone !!

Cheers
D

 

MW,

No, it's lawabiding citizens pushed to the limits by a group of lawless persons with no respect for authority. It would save the police having to go and risk their lives.

It's very easy to be PC when it's not affecting you.

Also, those of us that are fortunate enough to live in areas unaffected by this violence will have their police forces denuded to cope with it, leaving us all fair game for petty criminals/burglars etc

As I said before, we, the taxpayer, all pay in the end via higher insurance premiums/higher taxes/higher poll tax etc etc.

And what will they do with the rioters/looters if they catch them? Community service/slap on the wrist - how effective is that?

Bring back the birch I say.

CF

 

Here's a situation.

A vigilant group of 50 or so people form. Armed with bats and sticks they come across a dozen looters tuning out a branch of aldi and set about them with gay abandon. Everyones having a high old time (apart from a few looters with fractured skulls but we won't worry about them) until the main body of the riot (say 150) comes on sceen. Unhappy with the 50 or so people spoiling their fun, they wade in complete with bats, bottles, shivs and the occasional gun.

Now we have 50 "honest citizens" being badly killed to death by the rioters.

Next the police line of, lets say 100 odd overtired and underpaid specials hoves into view. Whereas before they were happy to contain the rioters, they now can't because there is bloody murder being done in front of them. Since the vigilantes and the rioters are both wearing primarily blood and are thus hard to distinguish they also have the challenge of knowing to whom they should administer a good kicking.

They have the unenviable choice to A:, let the vigilantes get killed to death, or B: wade in and try to separate 200 armed combatants, arrest them all (which they can't anyway cos they have nowhere to put them) and collect all the body parts. Now If I was a policeman, I'd want none of EITHER of those, and would be rather narked with the vigilantes for putting me in that position.

Then the paramedics have to get through, which they can't because the roads are blocked, and try to pick up the pieces, which is tricky because half the wounded are still cuffed and fighting mad. They have to get them to the hospital, which is full, along with the policemen who were hurt trying to break up the brawl. Meanwhile, the balance of the rioters, in none to positive a frame of mind, are furious with the vigilantes for beating up their mates, and the police, for using excessive force to break up the brawl. Bloody rich guys, they say, did you see them smash billies brains out with that bat? Lets show the bastards who owns the streets. They take it out on the homeowners up the street by setting fire to it.

Etc, Etc.

No, vigilantism is not the answer. It assumes the vigilantes will be better armed, more numerous and better equipped than the rioters. Otherwise it turns property damage into an armed conflict. So far only one death has come of the riots. If a bunch of locals with bats had wandered into the riots yesterday to dispense justice the figure would be much higher.

 

Update from my area, just had an email from a patient that has a lot of van drivers working for her.

They are reporting rioting in progress in the Crystal Palace area of south London

That would explain one of the choppers

I think we are in for a very bad night

Hope I'm wrong
cheers
D

 

wind it in catfoot, I was making a point 2 wrongs don´t make it right.

The Government need to Govern and if that means the Army then so be it.

Lynch mobs and random acts of Violence will just make it worse.

 

Nothing to do with PC. Its expedience. Firemen don't want us in burning buildings fighting fires, they just want to rock up outside and squirt water in from a safe distance. I suspect exactly the same applies with policemen and riots.

Their job is hard enough as it is!