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MBT's - good or bad?

Discussion in 'Biomechanics, Sports and Foot orthoses' started by Jacqui Walker, Jan 21, 2009.

  1. Peter

    Peter Well-Known Member


    I could not agree more with this quote. Working with an Orthotist has given me a different dimension to musculoskeletal biomechanics of the lower limb.
     
  2. rozza

    rozza Welcome New Poster

    MBT Shoes

    {ADMIN NOTE: Threads merged}

    Does anyone have any experience/opinions of MBT shoes. I have a pt who I have been seeing for several years with considerable plantar callus across the met heads, paring down frequently only to be faced with more of the same on my next visit. On her own initiative she purchased some MBT shoes, which I had not previously heard of, and miraculously she is now free of the callus - is this down to the shoes? Would they be useful for other foot conditions and can they be worn by arthritic and diabetic patients. I believe they are quite costly and would like to know if anyone else has had good results from them before suggesting them to other pts on the basis of one success story! Thanks.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 2, 2009
  3. efuller

    efuller MVP

    Re: MBT Shoes

    Hi,

    The MBT shoes have a midfoot rocker that forces you to choose one of the following 1) putting your weight on your heel, 2)balancing on a narrow point when standing or 3) putting your weight on your forefoot when standing. The rocker can reduce forefoot pressures during walking. So, it is possible that the shoes are responsible for the callus reduction you saw. I would not expect the callus reduction in these shoes if your patient had a significant equinous. Some patients love them, others hate them.

    There was another thread on MBT shoes. Perhaps admin can join them?

    Regards,

    Eric Fuller
     
  4. Boots n all

    Boots n all Well-Known Member

    Re: MBT Shoes

    Or it could be the other pair's of shoes were poorly fitting and the new pair simply fit snugger reducing the movement in the shoe, reducing the callusing effect?
     
  5. rozza

    rozza Welcome New Poster

    Thanks for replies - have since discovered previous threads regarding these shoes and remain to be convinced by them!!!
     
  6. efuller

    efuller MVP

    I am convinced that some people who wear them love them and some people who have worn them hated them. They will work for some people. Someone was telling me that there is a $34 knock off. That is much less of an risk/investment than $200.

    Cheers,

    Eric Fuller
     
  7. pgcarter

    pgcarter Well-Known Member

    I have a couple of patients that have purchased MBT's due to the aggressive marketing of them by a local physio practice, after spending 2 times $369 for shoes and sandals she discovers that the inherent instability of the design is beyond her ability to adapt to. She is elderly and has reduced proprioceptive return and reduced muscle bulk in lower limbs. In my mind she should be elligible for a full refund because they are not suitable for the purpose for which they are intended. Not much chance of that in reality. Having said that I do like them for younger stronger folks with range of motion loss problems, it does smooth things out in progressing over the stance foot.
    regards
    Phill Carter
     
  8. moggy

    moggy Active Member

    Hi Jacqui
    I seem to remember last year at the biomechanics summer school that this issue was raised and the consensus seemed to be that they do not live up to the hype - I have had some pateints and colleagues who swear by them but I have also had pateints who have had real problems with them - I vaguely remember someone saying that removing the heel has the same affect as putting a four inch heel on the shoe - I think it was Emma who said that??? check out the research - you may find it was funded by MBT and is just a little bit biased. I think the funniest claim I heard about footwear was the cellulite reducing flip flops!!!
    Claire
     
  9. admin

    admin Administrator Staff Member

    The MBT people not the brighest around. Look at the Wikipedia page:

    Masai Barefoot Technology

    Redirect to:

     
  10. laurence P

    laurence P Welcome New Poster

    Hello,

    I wore the shoes according to the guidance in the DVD and quickly developed a serious bilateral Achilles tendon injury. I have been battling this injury for over 5 months now, with ice, physio, sports massage, osteopathy etc, to little effect.

    Really annoyed with the whole thing as I have always been fit and healthy and usually recover well for sport's injuries.

    The other thing about it is that I have always trained with bare feet, all my life, in martial arts. These shoes' effect has strictly nothing to do with the motion of walking with bare feet.

    I am amazed they can continue to advertise all the medical benefits with no challenge. I brought this matter to the attention of Consumer Direct and Trading Standards but they took no interest in it whatsoever.

    Laurence
     
  11. Spike

    Spike Member

    All I can say is that after meeting numerous Masai recently, not one was barefoot. Nearly all were wearing sandals they make themselves out of old car tyres!
     
  12. Graham

    Graham RIP

  13. Griff

    Griff Moderator

  14. Footproman

    Footproman Member

    Any opinions on the effect (long or short term) of an unstable rocker, such as an MBT, Sketchers, etc. on a perfectly normal, healthy individual?

    I get questions all the time from my customers/patients regarding their effectiveness, or whether I have concerns about their efficacy. Most times I tell them that they can try them to see if they'll work. Yet I have always had this reservation that a rocker, when not needed, can affect normal mobility to the point of actually causing a problem. Am I right to have such a reservation?
     
  15. efuller

    efuller MVP

    Some people love, others hate them. It makes some feet feel better and others worse. You're probably not going to figure out which group you are in during the time you are in the store. If you buy the shoes because you want to work your muscles more, you could just go for a run. You pay your money and take your chances.

    Eric
     
  16. CraigT

    CraigT Well-Known Member

     
  17. Craig Payne

    Craig Payne Moderator

    Articles:
    8
    I commented in the MBTs and windlass mechanism thread that I have transitioned to the dark side and have been given a pr, so am wearing them....

    ...within 10 minutes of wearing them I developed bilateral mortons neuroma like symptoms (severe on one side) ...
     
  18. laurence P

    laurence P Welcome New Poster

    For people who paid for their MBTs and found that they caused more damage than benefits, you may be interested to know that following a few emails to MBT and the shop I had bought the shoes from, I was given a full refund ( £175) by the shop on return of my (used) shoes. For info, the shoes caused me serious Achilles tendons problems.
     
  19. Footproman

    Footproman Member

    Thanks for the response. I guess I am more looking for anyone's opinion on how the rocker affects saggital plane motion on a person with normal gait, without any foot pathology. My suspicion is that the exaggerated forward motion could possibly produce ankle pain or anterior compartment syndrome.
     
  20. efuller

    efuller MVP

    What exaggerated forward motion? How would theses shoes increase stress on the ankle or increase anterior compartment pressure?

    Eric
     
  21. Footproman

    Footproman Member

    Faster plantar flexion at foot flat and limited dorsiflexion at toe off. I've noticed that the shoe does not have a flex line and so limits effective dorsiflexion of the great toe at toe off. This logically would result in a shortened (and therefore inefficient) gait pattern.

    I'm also thinking that MBTs affect the windlass mechanism due to the rigidity of the shoe.

    I'm just spitballing here...
     
  22. efuller

    efuller MVP

    Some of these shoes have a very soft heel that compresses with heel contact. If you have a hard heel, especially with more posterior flare, you will get more plantar flexion moment from ground reaction force. With a soft heel, you will have a smaller plantar flexion moment from ground reaction at heel contact.

    The MBT's have a rocker bottom with rocker placed close to the center of the shoe. As you pivot over this point, the shoe may be rigid, but it achieves a plantar flexed position relative to the ground. So, it is not really limiting sagital plane motion.

    There is a difference between moments and positions of the windlass mechanism. People think that you have to have dorsiflexion of the MPJ for the windlass to "work". It depends on what is meant by work. The windlass can create the forces that create a plantar flexion moment of the forefoot relative to the rearfoot. (Just try and dorsiflex 1st toes of several feet when they are standing. You can palpate the arch and see that there is tension in the fascia. In some feet there is quite a bit of tension even though the toe is not dorsiflexed

    Eric
     
  23. Don ESWT

    Don ESWT Active Member

    G'Day all,:deadhorse:
    Rocker bottom soles have been around long before MBT. Most orthopaedic footwear makers were making them at Blues Point Road post WW2 for veterans with foot related war wounds. They were specifically made.
    Now days rocker soles are made by many companies and have become more of a fashion item. It could be in years from now they might develop a shoe with a flat sole so that the foot has no lift at the heel and no bend at the forefoot.:butcher:
    But hang on we have the "thong - flip flop- Japanese safety boot" !!!!!:sinking::boxing:

    Don Scott
     
  24. Jacqui Walker

    Jacqui Walker Active Member

    Thanks everyone for the interesting discussions.
    The answers have offered some thought provoking exercises, and taken me off at tangents at times.
    I agree with the benefit of a rocker bottom shoe for certain patients and that not one treatment fits all. Every patient is individual, and should be approached as such, but would like to see that it was someone qualified making the recommendations/prescription, and not a salesman who does not have the time or interest in the customers medical history.
    My initial question was generated by the hard sell that I was on the receiving end of. I forgot to mention that I was on crutches at the time due to knee surgery - and the salesman still thought I was a prospective customer!:bang: Never once asked my why the crutches?:confused:
    On a different but related tack, was at an Agricultural show and watched amazed as a company selling orthotics 'to fit while you wait', were prescribing clients orthoses from a pressure plate whilst they were sitting! Think these were around the £300 too!
    Jacqui
     
  25. Boots n all

    Boots n all Well-Known Member

    Oh hey l can do better than that, l was at an Ag show last weekend where a guy was selling orthotics, one fits all foot types and they work in Crocs was their big sell:wacko:
     
  26. Jacqui Walker

    Jacqui Walker Active Member

    LoL. To quote my husband "the things you see when you haven't got a gun!"
    :butcher: My husband had to drag me away from the stand when I heard the saleswoman announce, 'well yes you could see a Podiatrist but she wouldn't be able to do for you what we can, you'd have to wait weeks for anything to go in your shoes!' Perhaps we need to start a marketing drive around the country at these shows?:pigs:
    Jacqui
     
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