Welcome to the Podiatry Arena forums, for communication between foot health professionals about podiatry and related topics.
You are currently viewing our podiatry forum as a guest which gives you limited access to view all podiatry discussions and access our other features. By joining our free global community of Podiatrists and other interested foot health care professionals you will have access to post podiatry topics (answer and ask questions), communicate privately with other members (PM), upload content, view attachments, receive a weekly email update of new discussions, earn CPD points and access many other special features. Registered users do not get displayed the advertisments in posted messages. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our global Podiatry community today!
If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.
after reading a little about the benefits of the mbt footwear in shock absorption i was wondering if they could be recommended for hallux limitus? any thoughts please
I can't help you with the mbt, but the best shoe that I have found for shl is the Etonic Minato. This shoe has an excellent rocker sole. I can even make it rigid without needing to add to the rocker. The rocker also starts proximal to the mets which helps with lots of other forefoot problems.
after reading a little about the benefits of the mbt footwear in shock absorption i was wondering if they could be recommended for hallux limitus? any thoughts please
Yes I would and have recommended MBTs for symptomatic structural hallux limitus and rigidus with good results. Don't recommend them for anything/anyone else but I get lots of queries from patients about them.
Rebecca
I wear MBT shoes for a hallux limitus condition and am pleased to say that I remain symptom free by wearing them. Hope that helps you. I also recommend them to my patients with similar conditions.
I have had quite a lot of clinical experience with MBTs and I have found them to be very good for the treatment of hallux limitus and especially in the case of post operative treatment for sugical fusion of the first MPJ where dorsal pressure can occur with orthotics. I have found that they are mainly problematic when there is hypermobility present, especially in the knees. I would contraindicate them in unstable ankle joints, when genu recuvatum is present, and also when neuromas are present as it is seems that the increased movement of a mobile forefoot seems to aggrevate this. However I have found it to be very good for plantar fascitis. I have found them too heavy to run in so I feel orthotics are always a much better option for this. Hope this helps.
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to julietmollica For This Useful Post:
I have bilateral h. Rigidus and have worn mbt's for years. They have worked fine for my toes, but are, by design, unstable from side to side and unsuited to uneven surfaces. I just discovered a great pair of running shoes. Nike air torch runners (316124 010). They are stiff enough, stable, and flex at just the right spot! They are way lighter than mbt's and put less stress on my knees and hips. I'm going to buy 5 pairs as they are out of production. The soles are hard rubber and are available on other Nikes, so there may be other options. They look a little weird for work, but so do mbt's. Way cheaper $60 at Sports Authority. Walk around the store in various sizes, as the toe flex has to happen in just the right spot, which is not crucial in hard rocker soles.
Before you do anything, get a client/friend that's being wearing the MBT for 6 months and then video their gait at ground level from both behind and in front and make your choice
Have had personal experience of MBTs. They are fabulously comfortable not just for feet but great shock absorption for backs and knees.Have advised a number of patients to try them for hallux limits with great success ESP as now a wide selection of styles and one shop allows you to try at home before you buy. Have had some patients use them instead of anti pronatory orthoses as they encourage supination. Not good in icy weather though.
Any rigid shoe could be good for hallux rigidus. As you can see from the testimonials above, some people love them. I've also had patients hate them. Whenever I recommend shoes like these I tell people that some people love them and others hate them.
Eric
The Following User Says Thank You to efuller For This Useful Post:
I found that Sketchers Shape ups and their derivatives have been great for relief of my right hip pain and right forefoot pain, especially when walking around London all day and dancing salsa. When dancing I can move around on the mid foot and so keep my forefoot offloaded and when walking on pavements and in superstores I can just feel my gait being more propulsive. Terrible for walking on rough ground though, so then a I use a pair of Caterpillar walking boots that have a shallow rocker fore and aft and side to side. I often recommend Sketchers to my patients when appropriate.
regards Dave Smith
__________________
Descartes seems to consider here that beliefs formed by pure reasoning are less doubtful than those formed through perception.
Yes ,a few patients don't want to bother trying to accommodate orthoses and have found MBTs seem to reduce their pro nation symptoms. Katie
That isn't my experience with MBTs at all. Numerous cases of exacerbated Tibialis Posterior symptoms with them come to mind. I haven't noticed them consistently increase STJ supination moments (external) either.
... MBTs seem to reduce their pro nation symptoms. Katie
Tend to agree with IG here. Had more than a few pts with PTTD complain of increased pain following the use of MBT`s directed by well meaning friends/health professionals. Care to elaborate on their ability to reduce `pronation symptons`?
[quote=blinda;231157]Tend to agree with IG here. Had more than a few pts with PTTD complain of increased pain following the use of MBT`s directed by well meaning friends/health professionals. Care to elaborate on their ability to reduce `pronation symptons`?[/.
Was advised by the people displaying MBTs at a conference trade fair that patients can often go without their orthoses when wearing the shoes because of the tendency for the foot to roll on the lateral border during gait. Have not advised any patients to wear them instead of orthoses but have had a small number who have tried them off their own bat and returned saying they have had a reduction in symptoms such as forefoot pain , big toe pain arch pain etc. All of which could be down to increased shock absorption and reduced flexion I accept but it helped. I think it is a case of choose your patient carefully before you advise. Can't say this is based a large caseload just a few with a mixed bag of symptoms. Katie
Tend to agree with IG here. Had more than a few pts with PTTD complain of increased pain following the use of MBT`s directed by well meaning friends/health professionals. Care to elaborate on their ability to reduce `pronation symptons`?
.
Was advised by the people displaying MBTs at a conference trade fair that patients can often go without their orthoses when wearing the shoes because of the tendency for the foot to roll on the lateral border during gait. Have not advised any patients to wear them instead of orthoses but have had a small number who have tried them off their own bat and returned saying they have had a reduction in symptoms such as forefoot pain , big toe pain arch pain etc. All of which could be down to increased shock absorption and reduced flexion I accept but it helped. I think it is a case of choose your patient carefully before you advise. Can't say this is based a large caseload just a few with a mixed bag of symptoms. Katie
Katie don´t believe things a rep tells you invested interest and all, hear what they say and investigate you might find they were telling porky pies.
MBT´s and rocker bottom shoes do work and have place in clinic practice, but it is important to understand how they work and " reducing pronation " is not one of them IMO
That isn't my experience with MBTs at all. Numerous cases of exacerbated Tibialis Posterior symptoms with them come to mind. I haven't noticed them consistently increase STJ supination moments (external) either.
Agreed. If you want to give someone a rocker soled shoe to help with hallux rigidus/severe structural hallux limitus, I would suggest a Ryn shoe. Same shape as an MBT/Sketchers Shape up but without the soft poron heel cushion. I'm of the school that doesn't believe that shock absorbing cushioned shoes are all good
Obviously don't believe the propaganda on their website about toning etc. They are just rocker soled shoes without such a spongy bit at the back that tends to increase external STJ pronation moments(in my experience)
__________________
I see you girls checkin' out my trunks
I see you girls checkin' out the front of my trunks
I see you girls lookin' at my junk, then checkin' out my rump, then back to my sugarlumps
World renown US Pedorthist Dennis Janisse will give a presentation called "Effect of Rocker Soles on Plantar Pressures and Lower Extremity Biomechanics" at the IVO2012 congress in March in Sydney. This is not specific about a particular product it promises to be interesting.
__________________
Karl -Heinz Schott
Certified Pedorthist C Ped CM (Australia)
Orthopaedic Shoemaker Meister, Podologe (Germany)
Adjunct Professional Fellow in the School of Health and Human Sciences Southern Cross University
Dee Why NSW 2099
Phone 02 9972 4488
Any rigid shoe could be good for hallux rigidus. As you can see from the testimonials above, some people love them. I've also had patients hate them. Whenever I recommend shoes like these I tell people that some people love them and others hate them.
Eric
Spot on.
Rigidity is the cake. Rocker is a good icing though.
Ron Bateman
Physiotherapist (Masters) & Podiatrist
I tried on these shoes and couldn't believe how much motion was going on in the rearfoot. Too much pronation. I could foresee many problems resulting from this. I certainly will not be recommending MBTs to my patients.
Agreed. If you want to give someone a rocker soled shoe to help with hallux rigidus/severe structural hallux limitus, I would suggest a Ryn shoe. Same shape as an MBT/Sketchers Shape up but without the soft poron heel cushion. I'm of the school that doesn't believe that shock absorbing cushioned shoes are all good
Obviously don't believe the propaganda on their website about toning etc. They are just rocker soled shoes without such a spongy bit at the back that tends to increase external STJ pronation moments(in my experience)
I have had excellent results fitting Ryn shoes for those with hallux rigidus, or very limited ROM in the 1st MPJ. Customers remark that they like the (frontal plane) stability and have better sense of control when they walk in the shoes. Ryn has a very rigid, reinforced PU midsole with almost no bend. Also find them to be very helpful for those with midfoot & ankle arthritis, and for some people suffering from plantar fasciitis.
__________________
Cam White
Regional Manager and Technical Consultant,
Novascarpa Group, LLC
Brands represented: Joya, Ryn, Terox
512-796-3012 cwhite@novascarpa.com
...a spongy bit at the back that tends to increase external STJ pronation moments(in my experience)
Goodaye Robin, I'm not disagreeing, don't know enough, but I would have thought that there would be less external pronatory moments than a solid lateral flared sole would make?, any replies from anyone appreciated, mark
Goodaye Robin, I'm not disagreeing, don't know enough, but I would have thought that there would be less external pronatory moments than a solid lateral flared sole would make?, any replies from anyone appreciated, mark
The Nigg paper from way back looked at pronation velocity vs midsole hardness and lateral flare. The pronation was faster, consistent with higher pronation moments from the ground, with more lateral flare and harder midsoles. This would be counter to the assertion that the spongy heel would increase pronation moment from the ground.
Eric
The Following User Says Thank You to efuller For This Useful Post:
Goodaye Robin, I'm not disagreeing, don't know enough, but I would have thought that there would be less external pronatory moments than a solid lateral flared sole would make?, any replies from anyone appreciated, mark
Hi Mark, you are right, that was poorly worded. The soft spongy bit doesn't increase the external pronation moments.
It would depend on the cop but the foot that has a medially deviated STJ axis that suffers with pronation related pathology will probabaly find that there will be greater internal supination moments required to prevent structures being damaged by residual external pronation moments versus a solid midsole shoe through the midstance portion of the gait cycle................................I think!
__________________
I see you girls checkin' out my trunks
I see you girls checkin' out the front of my trunks
I see you girls lookin' at my junk, then checkin' out my rump, then back to my sugarlumps
The Following User Says Thank You to RobinP For This Useful Post:
World renown US Pedorthist Dennis Janisse will give a presentation called "Effect of Rocker Soles on Plantar Pressures and Lower Extremity Biomechanics" at the IVO2012 congress in March in Sydney. This is not specific about a particular product it promises to be interesting.
where can we find something about this presentation? thank you, alessandro
MBT rocker sole footwear, for hallux limitus?
Re: MBT rocker sole footwear, for hallux limitus?
Linear Mode
