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AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Some of the sanctimonius classics are worth highlighting;
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It is not in the public interest to have podiatrists operating independently of the patient’s usual medical practitioner.
(my favourite)
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It should never be optional for podiatrists to inform the medical practitioner about the care they have provided to the patient.
(and vice versa?, quid pro quo?)
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In this respect it is our view that the proposed guidelines are unsatisfactory and unsafe. Many foot ailments have associated chronic health conditions, which require management and care from a medical practitioner.
(how do these two sentences fit together?)
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The AMA requests that the Guidelines confirm and provide for the role of the medical practitioner as the lead clinician for coordination of patient care to ensure patient care is not fragmented.
(yes, let's keep the subordination of other professions going like in the good old days)
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The prescription of anti-anxiety medicines is outside the scope of practice for podiatrists.
(say what?)
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For the same reasons itis equally dangerous and inappropriate to have podiatrists prescribing drugs of addiction.
(oh, because only real doctors would never abuse this privilege?)
Clearly 'Doctor' knows best. Same old negative waffle, must be a 'copy and paste' job from the nurse practitioners and midwives submission.
LL
__________________
***************************************** Remember, it's just a foot.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Another massive fail on behalf of the AMA.
This is a chance to work together for the betterment of patients, not an opportunity for grand-standing on their behalf. Their submission simply goes to prove how out of touch with Podiatry they really are.
Our profession saves lives. Full stop. How about the AMA cut the leash and let us do our jobs properly.
On the other hand if they would like us to assimilate I would be happy to pay an annual fee to join their ranks: on second thoughts, maybe not!
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Its very similar to the submission the the AMA(Vic) made to try and block the prescribing rights here in Victoria. Their submission went nowhere; was pretty much totally rejected by the Govt; ... ie they lost....I guess they learnt nothing from that experience.
Now with national registration, they want to take the fight nationally.
They now behaving like the little boy who lost the game and wants to take the ball home afterwards. They need to get over it and move on. ... and get their own house in order before throwing stones (and they were the exact words an official in Dept of Health used when I was talking to him about this!)
__________________ Craig Payne
__________________________________________________ ___________________________________ Follow me on Twitter | Run Junkie God put me on this earth to accomplish a certain number of things - right now I am so far behind, I will never die.
the doctor’s group also insists it is “not in the public interest” to have podiatrists operating independently of doctors.
What have we been doing for the last zillion years? No wonder govt officials take no notice of their arguments! They are being seen for what they are.
The battle has been fought. They lost. Its now all about the best way to implement it. Someone forgot to read the right memo before they wrote that submission.
__________________ Craig Payne
__________________________________________________ ___________________________________ Follow me on Twitter | Run Junkie God put me on this earth to accomplish a certain number of things - right now I am so far behind, I will never die.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Just like the great job that the AMA and the Medical Council are doing at protecting patients. I like the comment above about getting their own house in order first.
That argument was used in the submissions from the AMA(vic) and along with a lot of dirty tricks and lobbying behind the scenes. The legislation was passed and their efforts failed. Now they still trying to roll out the same old same old that was not accepted last time. They have to be very naive to think that it will work this time as well.
THE Podiatry Board of Australia has been accused of failing in its duty to protect patients in its support of podiatry prescribing.
The current laws around what a podiatrist can prescribe are determined by individual states. But the podiatry board, in a push to make the system consistent, has just completed a consultation on a national drug list for practitioners.
The drugs being proposed for the schedule include ciprofloxacin, doxycycline, mupirocin and also diazepam and the schedule 8 drug oxycodone.
In a strongly worded submission to the board, the AMA repeated its long-running claims that podiatrists lacked training either to prescribe medicines or supervise prescribing by other podiatrists.
It said the standards developed to accredit podiatric therapeutic courses - which podiatrists complete before being granted prescribing rights – did not guarantee public safety in line with the podiatry board's principal responsibility (see box).
"To our knowledge, there is limited medical input into the development and accreditation of course content of programs of study in podiatric therapeutics and yet the outcome from this activity has a significant impact on the medical health of patients," the AMA's submission said.
"It is vital that prescribers are adequately trained in organic and inorganic chemistry, physiology, biochemistry, and anatomy. Only after these core subjects are acquired can a course in pharmacology be properly used and integrated to treat patients."
It added: “[The] AMA objects to the inclusion of anti-anxiety medicines… We are not confident that podiatrists are adequately trained or appropriately qualified to prescribe these medicines. The prescription of anti-anxiety medicines is outside the scope of practice for podiatrists.”
There are fewer than 30 podiatric surgeons working in Australia and fewer than 20 endorsed podiatrists currently with the ability to prescribe schedule drugs. But according to the Australasian Podiatry Council there remains a "huge desire" among many of the 3300 registered podiatrists to take on a prescribing role.
Podiatrists have stressed that the prescribing of drugs such as oxycodone was usually limited to one-off doses – with the drugs administered mainly to alleviate pain before a procedure.
The podiatry board dismissed the AMA’s allegation, saying in a statement that it took “extremely seriously its primary role in protecting the public”.
The Chair of the Podiatry Board of Australia, Jason Warnock, said the requirements for endorsement to prescribe scheduled medicines were “stringent”.
“Endorsed podiatrists were well skilled to prescribe the drugs that state and territory governments around Australia have already determined can safely be prescribed by appropriately qualified practitioners.
“The process to gaining an endorsement on registration is thorough and rigorous. Only practitioners who are suitably trained, qualified and experienced to provide safe podiatric care with the use of scheduled medicines will be granted this endorsement.”
Training required for podiatry prescribing
Pathway One:
An approved program of study in podiatric therapeutics
Seven years clinic experience as a podiatrists where prescribing occurs
Pathway Two:
An approved program of study in podiatric therapeutics
20 hours web-based study
160 hours of practice supervised by a doctor or a registered podiatrist where prescribing occurs
__________________
***************************************** Remember, it's just a foot.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Of course the hysterical and knee jerk reaction from medical practitioners sick of nurses, pharmacists and now podiatrists stepping on the sacred turf of prescribing are demonstrated with the usual vigour:
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It is simple. Just do not ever refer anyone to a Podiatrist. If patients ask for a referral, tell them to go see another doctor for their referral as you do not believe in podiatry, any more than you believe in witchcraft. Simple!
and
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I never realised podiatrists even had a Board. What's their logo? A disembodied foot with a snake wrapped around it?
How can a discipline that never gets above the ankle fill a career? What does a podiatrist dream of? The calf? And I thought telling people with intractable psychosocial problems " It's probably a virus" was pointless.
On a less nihilistic note, oral Terbinafine and Itraconazole could be on the Pod List for multiple nail onychomycosis/mocassin pattern tinea pedis. GPs are totally pants at treating that so give the Footmen of Rohan a chance for therapeutic glory, is what I say.
Diazepam and Oxycodone! Taking the piss or what? Every bogan druggie and hoon dealer this side of Christmas Island will be hanging around foot clinics feigning plantar fasciitis and restless toe syndrome.
or
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Podiatrists and nurses did not study chemistry and does not need to have science knowledge as background to do their profession. How can they be allowed to prescribe if they don't know about the details of the drugs?
Government should not find an easy and cheap way out solving the problem which in the end can jeopardise patients' health. It seems like Labor Party thinks nurses and other allied health professional can treated as equal even with their limited knowledge about medicines.
See what we are dealing with here...
LL
__________________
***************************************** Remember, it's just a foot.
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Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyLisfranc
Of course the hysterical and knee jerk reaction from medical practitioners sick of nurses, pharmacists and now podiatrists stepping on the sacred turf of prescribing a....
See what we are dealing with here...
And these people were allegedly bright enough to get into medicine They are so blind that they can't see the writing on the wall.
They keep throwing up the "patient safety" argument to protect turf and yet other professions keep getting access to more and more medicine as the Govt keeps rejecting their arguments. The Govt makes the decisions when they have all the information in all the submissions before them and take advice from a whole range of sources. They then have repeatedly rejected the AMA's position. When will they get it that they are wrong?
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
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Originally Posted by DaVinci
And these people were allegedly bright enough to get into medicine
But I bet the ones complaining are potentially:
a) Not even medical doctors
b) the same ones that when someone comes in with an ingrown toenail they try and fix it themselves with a short course of oral cephalexin because "that will fix it"
c) are the same ones that don't share the same complaint about dentistry and vets using the title doctor/surgeon or prescribing scheduled drugs.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
I remember the same arguments put up by the AMA in the late 70s when our profession tried to improve our sevice to the general public. It was and always will be about them (AMA) and not the treatment afforded the public.
Time and time again they have demonstrated that they are not prepared to accept any cooperation in the holistic treatment of patients at all it is always the Doctor knows best well we know the truth.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
The AMA is the 'union' representing medical practitioners in Australia. Of course they are always going to take a stance against other health providers encroaching on what is traditionally their 'turf'. The job of the AMA is to protect the conditions, most importantly the income source of its members. But of course they're not going to come out and say it's about money and status, so they will always resort to 1) it is not safe for the public; and 2) nobody is as well trained / educated as a medical practitioner to prescribe scheduled drugs.
And this probably doesn't differ to podiatrists and the associations, unions / boards representing podiatrists. How many times have podiatrists on this very site criticised and demanded that their relevant bodies lobby to have non podiatrists prevented from doing what has traditionally been the domain of podiatrists. Imagine the comments on here from (some) podiatrists if tomorrow chiropractors decided to run a short course on sharp debridement, diabetic foot assessments and nail surgery that would then allow them to start doing these procedures. No doubt many podiatrists would demand that their relevant representative bodies publicly oppose any such move by chiropractors. And I have no doubt the argument would be fought would be along the lines of "podiatrists are better educated regarding foot care than chiropractors...and this is likely to lead to a decrease in standards and patient safety...".
In the end it's all just politics. Most likely the majority of medical practitioners coudn't care less whether or not podiatrists are allowed to prescribe a handful of scheduled drugs. And on the other hand there are probably a significant number of podiatrists out there who think that the AMA makes some very valid points in relation to prescribing by podiatrists.
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
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Originally Posted by Paul Bowles
Thanks Tony,
Those quotes made my day!!!
Anyhow, I must get back to asking my local GP to prescribe all my cases of fasciitis oxycodone - cos that will help!
As aparently will washing Diabetic wounds with saline solution daily and leaving it open to the air as one of my clients was recently told by her GP...."she'll be right"
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
I'm sure all podiatrists can cite examples of poor management by GP's in relation to a range of foot care issues as I'm sure all GP's can cite examples of poor management by podiatrists (or other health professionals). It really becomes a petty argument when we (all health profesionals) start using individual cases to support our arguments.
How many podiatrists out there still routinely 'prescribe' tea tree oil for onychomycosis for example?
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karen Watson
As aparently will washing Diabetic wounds with saline solution daily and leaving it open to the air as one of my clients was recently told by her GP...."she'll be right"
I do that with my fasciitis cases as well - just in case
In all seriousness, we are forgetting the fundamental element here - the patient. Its not about our income, its not about the GP's income, its not about the AMA's politics, it is about the patients well being.
A medical practitioners core business is not prescribing drugs - it is caring for the patient. End of story, this is why the AMA's argument will always fail.
I think Jason Warnock and the Board have done a great job in obtaining, implementing and commenting on this issue in the press so far. The Board (and members of it like Jason) are a credit to this profession!
Re: AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
Unfortunately (or fortunately) depending on how you look at it health care is about politics and it is also about income. And it's not just the AMA's politics it's our politics as well, the AMA are just better at playing politics than podiatrists are (more numbers, money, history, influence etc).
If podiatry wasn't about income how do you justify charging patients $600+ for a pair of orthotics that cost $100 (or thereablouts) to make?
Whilst most people working in health care are concerned for their patient's, it is naive and untruthful to suggest that money, politics and other factors don't have a significant influence. Unless of course you are one of those rare people that does all your medical work vountarily.
AMA Submission to Podiatry Board of Australia on Guidelines for Endorsement for Scheduled Medicines
I like the comment above about getting their own house in order first.
They are so blind that they can't see the writing on the wall. 
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